In October of 2003, Mary, Lexie, my brother Bob, and I had dinner with Jim and Marilyn Lovell at their restaurant in Lake Forest, Illinois. This is my story about that event.

The Lovell dining experience became available to us through the Astronaut Scholarship Foundation.  We had already had several other experiences with astronauts through the foundation and each one of them was very special.

Normally the dates for these experiences were set up through communication with the foundation. I was shocked one day when I received an email directly from Jim Lovell.  He was contacting me to try and arrange the date for our dinner.  After a few emails back and forth we set up the date for the dinner to be October 24^th, 2003.

Mary, Lexie, and I flew to Chicago on Thursday evening October 23, 2003 on a United Airlines flight.  The flight was not very full with only about 50 people on the plane.  I must complement the flight attendants on their service.  They treated everyone like they were in first class.

We paid for our first two glasses of wine.  After that the flight attendants brought us wine from first class in actual wine glasses and not the standard plastic cups. 

We had finished the second glass of wine and a steward came around and asked us if we would like another. The dumb founded look on my face must have been priceless.  So off he went and fetched us more wine.  Then shortly before we landed the stewardess from first class came by with the bottle and filled us up again.  She didn’t even ask us if we wanted more.

She also brought hot freshly baked cookies back to us and gave Lexie a plastic beaded necklace that she, the stewardess, had put together.  It was just amazing service.  As we exited the plane, I complemented the stewardess and told her that was the best flight I have had in a long time.  She pursed her lips in a kissing shape and told me "You kiss up so well!"  What a nice way to start the trip.

We took a taxi over from the airport to a motel in a suburb of Chicago called Lincolnshire.  It was quite a ways from the airport and cost us $60 to get out there!  Still it was better than having my brother Bob fight his way to the airport after he had driven for 5.5 hours from Michigan.  Bob was already at the motel when we got there.

When we left Dallas the temperature was about 90 degrees. When we got to Chicago the temperature was in the lower 40s!  That was quite a change.

Friday morning we drove South past downtown Chicago and went to the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry.  It took us almost two hours to get there from where we were staying.  Well Okay, we did stop for breakfast along the way.

The museum was much different than what I had imagined it would be like.  I was expecting something like the Smithsonian, but it was more of a kid oriented hands on place.  I did however want to see the Zephyr train they have on display as well as the Apollo 8 command module.

It was very nice to see the command module from a mission so significant as Apollo 8. It was also nice to show Lexie, Scott Carpenter’s Aurora Mercury spacecraft.   Earlier that summer, Lexie had dinner with the man who flew it. 

There were also several artifacts from Apollo 8 on loan to the museum from Jim Lovell.  One of the artifacts was listed as the first and only bottle of brandy ever flown to the Moon.  The bottle had never been opened.

Another artifact on display was the helmet that Jim Lovell would have worn on the moon during Apollo 13.  I really wanted to see that. Of all of the lunar space suit helmets, his was the only one that had a blue navy anchor sticker affixed at the front of the red stripe.

I had noticed this anchor during the movie, Apollo 13 and in 1995 at a lecture by Lovell. I asked him if his helmet really looked that way.  His response then was, "Yes it was accurate and it shows what level of detail the film crew went to in order to make the film accurate."  He also said that his actual helmet could be seen at the museum in Chicago.  So for me to see his helmet in person was a multi year follow-up to my original question.

I was rather disappointed with the manner in which the space artifacts where displayed.  I really don't think they were given the proper respect.  The display seemed haphazard to me.

It was also in the lobby of the Omnimax Theater.  So you did get a lot of traffic through there for people to see the stuff.  However, I think they need a lot of work on their display techniques.

At the museum we also saw an Omnimax film called "Wild Chimpanzees of Africa" by Jane Goodall.  It was a great movie.  By this time it was time to head back to our motel and get rested up for the big event of this trip.  I wanted to make sure that we were not too tired for the evening.

When I was making our travel reservations, I selected the location of our motel to be very close to Lovell's restaurant.  We were supposed to meet Jim at the restaurant at 7:00 PM and we got there by about 6:45.  I thought the building looked very impressive.  It appeared to me that they only offered valet parking.

We identified ourselves to the hostess and she said, "The Captain is waiting for you down stairs.  I'll let him know you are here." Up the stairs came Captain James Lovell, the Commander of Apollo 13. 

Through our email contacts were communicating on a fist name basis. I introduced myself to Jim.  I also introduced Jim to Bob, Lexie, and Mary.  He seemed to already know who was who in our party.  Jim seemed to be in a genuinely good mood and took us down stairs to what they call "The Captain's Quarters" to meet Marilyn.

Lexie had an unusual bout of stage fright and momentarily refused to walk down the stairs.  Jim offered to take us down, via the elevator. I explained to Jim that she would be OK.  I was holding Lexie’s hand to walk down the stairs. Lexie changed which hand she held my hand with and grabbed the staircase railing with her other hand.  After that she was fine.

We walked past the cigar bar and over to a leather couch in front of a fireplace.  Jim introduced us to Marilyn. He offered us drinks when the waiter came over. Mary, Lexie, and I sat on the couch.  Bob sat across from Marilyn in a wing back chair and Jim sat on the edge of the couch, slightly elevated above us.  The waiter brought our white wines and Lexie's Coke.  Jim also had white wine and Marilyn had a cocktail.

We had a very nice conversation. It was obvious the pride that Jim took in his restaurant.  Several times he mentioned that he would give us a tour of the artifacts on display later, just to sit back and relax for now.

On the mantle of the fireplace were copies of the trophies that had been presented to Jim.  One was the Collier Trophy awarded to the crew of Apollo 8.  Another was a "Lone Sailor" trophy he received only a couple of weeks ago for a lifetime of achievement in the Navy.  The third trophy I do not recall what it was.

There was a coffee table in between the couch and the fireplace.  Jim pointed out that displayed under the glass of the coffee table was a 3-D topographic map of one of the lunar landing sites. 

I asked Jim which Apollo mission that was from.  He answered that it was from Apollo 17.  I told him that I actually have that very same topographic map hanging on a wall in my home.  I really liked the way that he had his displayed much better and told him that I was trying to figure out a good way to display it.

Jim spoke about writing the book "Lost Moon".  I asked him how he became involved with the co-author Jeffrey Kluger.  He said that Kluger had written him a letter telling him that he had written several articles for Discover magazine and always wanted to write a book.

Kluger thought Apollo 13 would make a great story.  Coincidentally, Jim was also thinking about writing a book about Apollo 13 at the same time.  So they got together and wrote one of the chapters in the middle of the book.

Jim's publicist then shopped that chapter around to various publishers.   Several publishers turned them down.  It was unknown to Jim at the time, but the publicist also shopped the chapter around in Hollywood.

Finally a publishing contract was signed.  At about the same time a movie studio bought the rights for the film.  The interest by the Hollywood studio was a big shock to Jim since they had only written one chapter of the book.

Bob asked if it was Ron Howard who had bought the rights initially.  Jim’s response was no and that Tom Hanks is the one who actually convinced Ron Howard to do the movie.

At some point the conversation focused on my interest in the space program and I mentioned that I had attended five launches of the space shuttle.  I told them that I had seen two launches from the causeway, two launches from the press site, and one launch from the VIP site.  Jim asked if I had attended any of the launches of the old missions but said “I suppose you’re not old enough.”

I told him that I was old enough to remember them.  However, since I had grown up in Nebraska, Florida was too far away for me to attend any of the old launches.  I told him that during Apollo 8 I was perched in front of our black and white television with an old box camera. 

I took photos of his mission off of the television.  I told Jim that I had a photo of the Apollo 8 liftoff that Frank Borman had signed for me and I wished I had brought it with me, but had forgotten it at home.

Marilyn then made a comment about how I was kind of like Tom Hanks with his enthusiasm for the program while growing up.  Bob mentioned that I was always a real space enthusiast even as a young child.  He told them that I had even named pet pigs after astronauts.  Jim laughed and said he didn't know if he wanted to hear about that.

I then explained about three pigs that I raised in 1969, that I named Neil, Buzz, and Michael.  Bob said that Neil was really big too, about 500 or 600 pounds.  I told the Jim and Marylyn that I had Neil up until I left for college at which time she had passed away.

We had told Jim that we had visited the Chicago Museum of Science and Industry earlier in the day.  We informed him that we had seen his spacecraft.  Jim mentioned that all spacecraft are on loan from the Smithsonian and that it will be interesting if the Smithsonian ever recalls the Apollo 8 command module. 

Apparently when the theater was built they had to lower it through the uncompleted roof as none of the doors are wide enough to accommodate its 13 foot girth.  The dome was then cemented, so technically there is no way out for the command module.

Mary told Jim that we had seen the bottle of brandy he had brought back from the Moon and asked him why it was still full.  Jim said, “Well I thought it would be worth more if it wasn't opened”.  He said that was the first alcohol ever taken into space but that he assumes there has been more since then with the space station.  I said with the Russians involved I'm sure there has.  He said yes and that would certainly be Vodka.

Jim pointed to a bronze statue that was sitting on a table behind the couch.  He said that this was a smaller version of a statue of Jack Swigert. It was created for the "Hall of Heroes" in the Capital building in Washington, DC.  Every state is allowed to have two statues in this hall. A few years ago, Colorado realized they only had one statue.

After a voter referendum, it was decided that they would use a statue of Swigert as their second statue.  Swigert as you may recall was elected to Congress from Colorado but never was able to serve.  He passed away from cancer before ever taking office.

I never realized that there was such a statue in the Capital and told Jim and Marilyn that I would have to visit it.  They said that it would probably be hard to find because the house keepers of statues don't like it very much.  The bronze statue has a white patina on the space suit portion of it.  Apparently, the house keepers think it's too hard to keep clean.

Jim continued by saying that when it was delivered to the capital the workers refused to unload it and move it into place.  Somebody from the Colorado congressional delegation noticed a group of Boy Scouts touring the capital.  They enlisted the scouts to come over and move the statue onto its pedestal.

Jim then took us for a tour of the lower level of the restaurant. The first stop was at the glass display cases at the end of the room.  He wanted to show us the artifacts displayed in those cases. 

One item that Jim pointed out was a moon rock replica that Marilyn had gotten for Jim on their wedding anniversary. Their anniversary was June 6th.  Coincidentally, the night that we were at Lovell’s restaurant was Mary and my wedding anniversary.

Jim pointed out an optical sight from one of his spacecraft and I asked if that was from Aquarius.  He responded that no, the one from Aquarius was actually at his home.

I noticed a stainless steel model of a Gemini Titan rocket that was presented to Jim for one of his Gemini missions.  I told him that I had a similar model in my collection that had been presented to Ed White after his mission.  I explained to Jim that I had acquired White’s model in an auction.

While we were talking about artifacts, I mentioned that I also had purchased the watch strap the Buzz Aldrin wore on the moon.  Jim said that it sounded like the watch itself was finally located after all of these years.  I told Jim that I wasn't convinced that it was the real McCoy yet.  Later it was announced that it was not Aldrin’s watch.

Jim pointed to a letter that then President Bill Clinton had sent to him on the anniversary of one of his flights.  He kind of laughed when he pointed it out, so I don't think Jim was a big Clinton supporter.

Marilyn pointed to a stainless steel plaque in the case and asked Jim if that was the one that was supposed to have been attached to the leg of the lunar module on the moon.  Jim said that no, that the original was actually at home.  He then explained that the one attached to the leg had Ken Mattingly's name on it.  So they came up with one for Jim to attach on the surface with Jack Swigert's name on it due to the late crew switch.

There were many autographed photos on the wall.  These actually were replicas of the originals that reside in the Lovell's home. These replica autographs were created for the movie Apollo 13.

Two models in glass cases graced the entrance to this room.  One was a Saturn 5 that was about 4 feet tall.  The other was a Soviet N-1 model. I pointed to the N-1 and told Lexie that is what the Russians would have flown to the Moon if Jim had not put them out of business with his Apollo 8 flight.  Jim then mentioned that the real N1 was the same height as the Saturn 5 even though the models on display didn't show that.

We then toured the wine cellar which doubles as a private dining area for 12.  The restaurant had such a warm and cozy atmosphere.  I asked Jim if they had built the restaurant from scratch or if the building already existed.  He said that they built it from scratch and that it took them over a year to get convince the bank which owned the property to sell them the property.  With that delay they had an architect’s plan for the restaurant but no place to build it.

We took an elevator back up to the main dining floor.  Our table was waiting for us in a corner.  Marilyn suggested that the men sit by the wall so that that we didn't have to face the wall.  Deferring to her wishes I picked the hardest to reach chair on the inside.  Jim sat to my left.  Marilyn sat next to Jim.  Bob sat next to Marilyn.  Lexie was seated next to Bob and Mary was on my immediate right next to Lexie.

Jim said that he hoped we had not eaten all day because we would get plenty of food.  I joked with Jim that he must not eat here very often because he was way too thin. He said yes, his stomach would be out to here if he ate at the restaurant too often.

The waiter brought us menus and gave Jim a wine list.  Jim handed me the wine list and said that I should pick it out since it was our day.  That put a lot of pressure on me.

I didn’t know if Jim planned on picking up the cost of the wine or not. If he did, I didn’t want to pick anything too extravagant.  If I was paying for the wine, I did not want to pick out anything too cheap.

I scanned the list and found a white wine by Freemark Abbey that I was familiar with.  I showed the listing to Mary and asked her if she thought that was OK.  It was a $43 bottle of wine which wasn't the cheapest but certainly was nowhere near the more expensive selections either.  I truly wish Jim had picked the wine.

The waiter explained a couple of specials they had on the menu.  One was a type of fish called red snapper that was baked in parchment paper and then filleted and served at your table.  Jim and Marilyn explained that it was a brand new entree for the restaurant.  The waiter told Jim that they had reserved two of those specials for our table if we wanted them.

That was enough of the menu for Mary; she already knew what she wanted. The special had intrigued her.  Jim said, Okay, we have a test pilot!  Lexie selected the grilled salmon. Bob selected the New York strip.  Marilyn selected the fillet mignon.  Jim selected the pork chop.  Like Marylyn, I selected the fillet mignon.  That entrée came with twice baked Yukon Gold potatoes.  Everyone also selected salads with their meals except for me.  I chose the crab cake appetizer.

The waiter brought out the white wine, showing me the bottle. I was shocked as it was not a chardonnay.  It was from a grape that I did not recognize.  I did not realize this when I looked at the wine list.  I guess it was the pressure of not wanting to take too long to make a decision that caused this.  To avoid a scene I decided to risk it and hope the wine was actually appropriate for our meals.

The waiter uncorked the wine and offered me a taste.  Time passed slowly as the liquid flowed over my pallet.  Much to my relief, it was a good wine and was not too much different than a chardonnay.

Jim pointed out three limited edition lithographs hanging on the wall across from us.  The lithograph on the right was called "In the Beginning" by Alan Bean.  This particular piece of art has the autographs of over 20 of the Apollo era astronauts.  I told Jim that I also had that particular lithograph in my collection. 

I also pointed to the lithograph on the left.  I told Jim that I also had that one and that it was called "Naval Aviation in Space" by an artist named Rasmussen.  Jim was surprised that I knew the artist and commented that I must really know my space art.

The lithograph in the center I do not have a copy of. It was an Apollo 13 limited edition piece in Red, White, and Blue, which had been signed by the Apollo 13 crew. I had seen copies of this lithograph before, but have never acquired one. Jim said that he had a stack of those at home and probably was going to sell them either through an Auction at some place like Superior or through Kim Poor with Novaspace.  I told him if he every wanted to sell anything and skip the middle man to let me know.

Jim also mentioned that he was going to be at Novaspace in a couple of weeks doing a private autograph signing.  I was aware of this, but I didn't say too much about it.  I really wanted to see what his feelings were about signing autographs but didn’t know how to ask.

Jim answered the question without me having to ask it. He said that he doesn't mind signing autographs for true collectors, but does not want to sign for people doing this to turn a profit.

That put my mind somewhat at ease as I had been hoping to get Jim to sign a couple of pictures and a book later in the evening.  We also brought a book of Lexie's called "Grandpa Takes Me to the Moon" which she hoped to get signed.  I did not want to impose upon Jim if he was opposed to signing autographs.

Jim and Marilyn remarked that I must have quite a collection.  I told them that my goal was to someday build a museum.  Jim seemed intrigued by this.  I told him that after I retire I'd like to have a museum where I could display my space artifacts and educate people on the exploration of space.

Lexie told them that my house already was like living in a museum.  Mary told the Lovell's that we were actually redecorating the front of the house to display the artifacts more appropriately.  Mary didn't mind my collecting habit, as it was getting her house remodeled.  I just smiled.

Jim asked what I did for a living and I told him that I was an electrical engineer and worked for Cisco Systems.  I told him that I designed integrated circuits.  I also explained briefly my employment history.  I told him how I had worked at startup companies that tend to be acquired by larger companies.  I mentioned that I one point I worked for Hewlett Packard.

Jim said that he had seen my former CEO a few weeks ago.  Carly Fiorina was at Disney World as were several astronauts for the opening of the new space ride at Epcot.  Jim mentioned that Carly's husband was a space enthusiast and he was hoping that HP might become a sponsor of the Astronaut Scholarship Foundation.  I told Jim that HP already some exposure to space sponsorships as the views of Russian Mission control have shown HP banners for quite some time.

Jim seemed really surprised by this.  He said, "You mean in Kaliningrad?"  I told him yes, that's the place.  This was really intriguing to Jim and he seemed to hope this would help him acquire an HP sponsorship.  It was fun to watch his "wheels" turning over this prospect.

The salads and my crab cake appetizer were brought out.  Everyone loved the salads and I loved my crab cakes.  Appropriately, they were made from Texas blue crabs.

Mary's special dinner was brought table side on a cart by the waiter. He then proceeded to remove the parchment paper and fillet the fish. Bob commented that this was just like shore lunch in Canada.

I told Jim that Bob and I had been fishing in Canada a couple of years ago.  He asked where and I told him in the Northwest Territories at Great Slave Lake.  Jim responded that he had been fishing at Great Slave out of the town of Yellowknife.  Bob explained that we were on the other end of the lake from Yellowknife.

I told Jim the story about our 727 charter flight to our fishing lodge. I told him how amazed we were that the 727 landed on a gravel runway. I also mentioned that we did fly over just before attempting to land. That was just to make sure there were no wild animals on the runway.  I told Jim that was the first place I landed where there were people standing by on the side of the runway with shotguns.  They were ready to shoot any wild animals that might wander out onto the runway.

Mary's meal was now ready. The rest of our meals were brought out.  My fillet mignon was very nice.  It was cooked to perfection as were the twice baked potatoes.  Bob also enjoyed his New York strip.  Lexie's salmon disappeared, so I can only imagine that she didn't have any complaints either.

Since we were talking about the Arctic and fishing, I had remembered seeing a news article about Jim making a trip to the North Pole.  I mentioned this to Jim.  He said that he had actually made it to both the North and the South poles.  His South Pole excursion occurred when he was on a team hunting meteorites in Antarctica.  He said that their team had found 19 meteorite specimens while they were in Antarctica and was proud of the accomplishment.

Marilyn noticed that Mary was eating very slowly.  She was picking at her fish. Marilyn asked if Mary didn't like the fish.  Remember, Mary was the test pilot for a brand new dish from the kitchen.  Mary said that the problem with the fish was that there were a lot of bones in it.  The fish tasted great, it was just extremely difficult to eat.  Mary apologized and explained that she wasn't complaining. Mary told Marilyn that she had experience in the restaurant business. She thought the Lovells might want to know about the issue with the bones.

Jim and Marilyn were both very grateful for Mary's honesty. They also offered to get Mary another dish if she desired one. Marilyn thought they should stop serving this dish immediately until it was perfected.  Jim said that they would take it up with the staff and get the situation corrected.  It was nice to feel comfortable enough with the Lovells to offer them constructive criticism.

I had to ask Jim at least one question about his missions during our dinner.  I knew that he had heard all of the questions, thousands of times before.  Still, it just seemed like a missed opportunity if I didn’t ask him something mission specific. The question that I finally came up with was, "Of your four space flights which one of them would you say was the most difficult?"

The easy answer would have been to say Apollo 13.  I wanted to hear what he had to say though.

Jim pondered that question and responded that it would have to be Gemini 7. That answer surprised me.  I then said, "So you found Gemini 7 more difficult than Gemini 12, even though Gemini 12 was your first mission as commander?" "Yes" he said.  "By the time Gemini 12 came around space flight was old hat for me."

I commented on how successful and important Gemini 12 was with regard to solving previous Eva difficulties.  I mentioned Gene Cernan's problems on Gemini 9. Jim said that all of the previous EVAs had their difficulties not only Gemini 9.  The success of Gemini 12 certainly was important.  He said they trained for Buzz's Eva in a swimming pool in Baltimore.

Jim mentioned that there was an Eva training pool at the Johnson Space Center.  He said it was built in the building that used to house the centrifuge.  I told him that I was actually in that building during a training exercise for Linda's STS-76 flight.  I related how exciting it was to know that my friend was underwater doing real training while I stood on the edge of the pool.

I also let Jim know that JSC now has a new weightless training facility over at Ellington Field.  I informed him that the new one is much larger than the one in the old centrifuge building.  I told him that now they can conduct multiple Eva simulations simultaneously.  Marilyn commented to Jim that I new more about it than he did.

Lexie was comfortable at the dinner and was not intimidated.  At one point she asked Jim and Marilyn if they had heard the joke where the duck goes into a bar. Marilyn looked confused and we explained that it was one of Lexie's favorite jokes. Lexie's joke goes like this:

A duck walks into a bar and asks the bartender, "Got Grapes?”

The bartender responds "No, we don't have any grapes."

The duck leaves and comes back the next day.  The duck asks the bartender, "Got Grapes?"

The bartender is irritated and says "No we don't have any grapes and if you come in here again and ask for grapes, I'll nail your feet to the bar!!!"

The duck leaves and comes back the next day.  He asks the bartender "Got nails?"

The bartender once again irritated responds "No we don't have any nails!"

So the duck says "Got grapes?"

Jim laughed, Marilyn was stoic.  Jim turned to Marilyn and said "You didn't get it did you?"  He then explained the punch line.  How many eight year olds have had the opportunity to tell a joke to the commander of Apollo 13 over dinner?

The entrees were filling, but that didn’t stop anyone from having desert. I selected the crème brûlée.  The deserts were outstanding.

I knew our meal was coming to a close, so I asked Jim if he would mind autographing a couple of photos and a book.  He said he would be happy to sign the items.  One of the photos was a photo of the damaged service module from Apollo 13.  He inscribed that with “Houston, we have a problem.”  The other photo was a photo of him on board Apollo 8. He inscribed that “to Jerry and Mary, Merry Xmas from Apollo 8.”

Lexie had her book signed and I also had him sign a leather bound copy of Jules Verne’s “From The Earth To The Moon.”  Jim mentioned how accurate many of Verne’s predictions in the book where.

Jim also said that he personally suggested to the Apollo 11 crew that they should name the Apollo 11 command module Columbia because of Columbia in Verne’s book.  I did not realize that the origin of the Apollo 11 command module name came from Lovell.

We asked Jim and Marilyn if there was a place where we could have our picture taken with them.   Jim suggested that we have our photo taken in front of the restaurant’s bar.

That was the most scenic location in the restaurant because of the huge mural sized painting that was displayed behind the bar.  The painting was called “Steeds of Apollo”.  The painting had a connection to Jim Lovell and the Apollo 13 crew. The horses depicted in the Apollo 13 crew patch were derived from the painting.

It was painted by artist Luman Winter.  Winter was commissioned in 1969 to do this painting by the St. Regis Hotel in New York.  When the hotel was renovated, the painting was removed.  For many years its location was unknown.

During the filming of Apollo 13, the painting resurfaced at a Superior Galleries auction in Los Angelus.  Tom Hanks dispatched his wife to purchase the painting.  Hanks then presented the painting to Jim Lovell as a gift. The painting has become a signature display at Lovell’s of Lake Forest.  It was a beautiful backdrop for our group photo.

We said our goodbyes to Jim and Marilyn.  They headed back to talk with the restaurant staff about the red snapper fillet problems.  We headed out the door, feeling considerably enriched for having had dinner with Jim and Marilyn Lovell.